We've done so much to try to prevent this - buying the softest mats you can get, keeping him at pasture and off the geotiles completely...I even bought some leg wraps I thought would work but did not.
J said to call the vet and I said, no, whined weepily, "There is nothing the vet can do. He knows about this and he told me to make the horse comfortable." I spent the night agonizing.
The last occurrence was December and I kept Mag's legs clean and medicated and kept him out of the deepest mud. I also keep track of where and when he falls - mostly afternoon.
This morning I ran half dressed to the paddock and he was holding up one leg, licking the bloody wound. I've never seen a horse do that.
When the vet arrived he leaned over our gate and said, "There's a name I'm trying to remember." I said, "Mine or the horse's?" He said, "YOU are 'B. Aquarius'. I meant the condition." I said, "It's not narcolepsy." He said, "That's it! Narcolepsy."
I'd spent the morning driving to BFE (that acronym really shows my age, huh?) to get him some padded bell boots, on EvenSong's recommendation. Why didn't I take her advice months ago? Cuz I thought we were managing it, among other things.
I was able to find some really cushy neoprene bell boots like half an inch thick that fit perfectly. One of the reasons I resisted her advice was the idea of putting on bell boots *upside down* scared me. They will simply become cups to carry around the mud he sinks in, and keep his wounds soaked with mud even when he's not in mud! Ellensburg has quite a bit less mud than West Germany.
But lo and behold I was able to put them on right-side-up, above his fetlock. No way for mud, rain, and hay to collect in there.
The vet approved when he arrived. And recommended that the horse be stalled at night. I told him Mag "falls" asleep in the day, not the night. While I could lock both of them in the two stalls during the day, I will only use that as a last resort. Things are changing around here, anyway.
We had 30 trees removed last Tuesday. THIRTY, from 72, the wooded lot between our house and our field. Today we began the process of building a horse fence on 72. This is after I spent the last 9 months ripping out blackberries and clearing old wood piles. 9 months has made a huge difference in 72 and I have video and photos but that's gonna be another (few) posts.
I disagreed with my vet that Mag has narcolepsy. I think of narcolepsy as a sudden attack of sleep in the midst of a normal activity - such as a horse being ridden at a show, that suddenly collapses.
Cataplexy or pseudo-narcolepsy, I agree. I'm so sick of reading about this.
Before anyone says, "It's cuz you keep your horse with a donkey," I've seen horses exhibit the exact thing (on YouTube) with other horses right there beside.
I can't help but recall the scene in Black Beauty where the lady says, "I cannot have a horse with knees like this!" Indeed, Mag has fetlocks like that. Although he has very odd scars all over, these ones are just awful.
He's biting at the neoprene because I know it hurts under there. I used the antiseptic wash and sulfa cream. The antiseptic really seemed to hurt him.
I'm certain he understands my apologies tonight for hurting him.
One last thing....exactly like Baasha, Mag seems to love this vet. He takes liberties with him that I don't allow, such as trying to remove his reading glasses from his pocket (nearly succeeding!) and zipping and unzipping his jacket. Nibbling the toes of his hiking boots, gently rubbing his forehead against the vet's chest. I'm trying not to cry cuz Baasha loved that vet so much. I whispered to J, "Veterinarian love."
Random photo from the cloud - happier days (April 2018). This is me in Shelton, WA, finding a hunter's discarded animal parts while geocaching. Medics have to know about these parts.
14 comments:
My old trainer had a horse diagnosed with narcolepsy. He wasn't able to hold himself up reliably once he fell asleep. There wasn't anything she could do to fix it, but he always had access to a deeply bedded stall even when turned out. (through a run-in)
CFS, What did your trainer's horse's legs look like?
I wish more people knew about this - a neighbor has a horse with big scars on the fronts of his fetlocks and I said, "He has a sleeping disorder - he doesn't lie down." How on earth do you find that information - I looked forever online for "wounds on the fronts of fetlock joints."
The deeply bedded stall was my vet's first suggestion, and he's right. But I think I did it wrong. I just bedded it and hoped he'd lay down in there. He never did, but both animals went in there and used it as a litter box. They'd just go in there, pee, and leave. WTH.
The vet assured me our stalls are big enough to lock animals inside. I don't agree, but mostly I'm conditioned against locking a horse in a stall altogether. But I will have to go there, if I must. I guess - a midday stalling for a few hours isn't so horrible. AGH I don't know.
I dont know much about narcolepsy but we had a mare at the barn that would just drop like that. She wasnt sleeping, but daydreaming, and she would fall like a stone. She was in her late teens when this started.
Dont worry too much about putting them in the stall for a few hours. Make it special for them with some nice hay and carrots. They might come to enjoy it. Horses are very adaptable.
Looking forward to the update on 72.
this article speaks to the same circumstances I have witnessed at our barn. If the mare stood around too much doing nothing, she would collapse.
https://instrideedition.com/equine-narcolepsy/
That's scary. Just curious, does he lay down to sleep normally?
Irish gets these periodically. I think it's because that he rarely lies down to sleep that he sometimes collapses. They heal up pretty quickly. Of all the things I have to worry about with him, this is not one of the things I focus on. I wonder if he just can't lock his legs to sleep standing up?
I have a horse that gets awful fetlock sores. I highly recommend bedsore boots aka fetlock shields. There are two types, ones that are neoprene that wrap above and below the fetlock, I haven't tried those. The ones I use look like an upside down bell boot but they're made of a heavy nylon fabric. I prefer these because they don't really touch the wound so they allow air to get to it. I would advise against putting a bell boot on above the fetlock for fear of causing a soft tissue injury. Also we're in Olympia WA and no issues with mud packing in them but they do need to be cleaned daily. Get 2 sets so they can dry between. This was a life saver for us!
Oh and deep bedded stall helps but it had to be DEEP deep, like a foot deep shavings. I don't do this at our current farm because our horses are never locked in.
Lytha, I think we’ve talked before about the correlation between lack of laying down REM sleep and the “narcolepsy” (I like your term that adds “pseudo” to that). And stress is often what limits the laying down. So if Mag is at all distressed by being locked in the stall, I wouldn’t go there! Plus, going down in a stall is riskier than out in the open. (Fizz once went down across the 2X6” threshold of her run-in, and banged up her hip, as well as her fetlocks. And there’s the danger of getting cast against the wall, too.)
I have three now who exhibit this falling down, and the fetlock scars that go along with it. Fizz does it the most, and has all of her life that her owner is aware of (she’s now 33). We keep her double-size run-in stall deeply bedded in shavings (everybody else has pellets), and we do see evidence in the mornings of her coming in and laying down in it. But come spring, her tendency towards laminitis will keep her locked in the paddock (with Kate) and that is stressful for her (especially when Kate has to leave with me). Sonny is the one that wears the bell boots, as his thin Arab skin seems so easily damaged. His issue is that it’s getting so hard for him to get up, due to arthritis, plus the fact that when he’s with a mare or two, he frets about his role of herd “stallion,” but when he’s with other geldings, he gets picked on—so we often keep him by himself, though that itself is stressful, too. I have spotted Comet occasionally starting to “fall” recently, but he is by nature a very anxious guy...
I wonder if the storm a week or so ago had something to do with it??
I hope that you can find the key to Mag’s issues, to make his life less stressful, and thereby, yours!
ND, I admit I am very concerned about locking my animals in stalls. They are quite small, and I've tried deeply bedding them before to tempt them to sleep but it didn't happen. We'll see.
Your article contains, as internally admitted, the same information as every article I've read. But it doesn't mention "Pseudo Narcolepsy" like the others. So I guess, we can generalize and say a horse who displays the behavior may use the diagnosis, despite not having the actual condition. Interesting. I'm more open minded now.
Shirley, I've seen Mag lying down once in 3 years. Not enough, I know. It's more than worrisome.
TA, I think the leg locking (stifle joint?) works only in dozing, not REM sleep. Horses who won't lay down experience REM while standing and then fall. If I understand correctly.
Is it possible to build a large run-in shed and bed it down well?
Shaste, that is a really great looking product! Unfortunately they're really expensive in Germany (58 Euros). I like the design compared to the Cashel ones you mention that don't allow air in and if they get wet, half the horse's leg stays wet.
The fetlock shields look like the perfect thing for preventing sores or keeping them from recurring once they are healed. They seem quite thin but I read an article online about them that they do the job.
I'm using a 100% neoprene bell boot very loose and they also allow air to get to the wounds (which are still covered in medication and cotton pads until they start to heal). I take them off every day to see if his legs are being affected and I see nothing yet.
Camryn, we're not allowed to build on this property. J mentioned buying another "drivable" shelter (you can actually put them on wheels) because those are allowed, because they are not a permanent structure. But we'd have to bulldoze an area to flatten it, which is also not allowed. I'm tempted to try though. We'll see.
Evensong, wow, it sounds like you have a very complicated herd situation! It's interesting to me that you have so many horses with this issue, but of course it is more likely to occur in retirees. Check out the fetlock sheild product Shaste mentioned above. They look like the perfect long-term solution. I want the ones for the hocks too because Mag often has bloody hocks from simply rolling out there (!!??).
Sad to read Mag is having these issues. Do you supplement with Magnesium?
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