Tuesday, March 10, 2015

Some differences in horse paradigms in Germany and America - and questions too

In the latest issue of my horsey magazine there is an interesting article about "low X horse feeds." Low starch, low calorie, low sugar, low protein, and oat free, and grain free. Finally the information is coming out, It took years before I saw/heard about low starch feeds becoming available in Germany. Oat free has been huge here for a long time, I've already mentioned that. No one wants evil oats! (Oats having the lowest starch of commonly used grains, I find it odd that the oat-free feeds use corn instead.)

I think most of us know that sugar should be as low as possible for all horses, especially barefoot horses. The nutritionist quoted in the article says low sugar feed is important for horses with PSSM, EMS, founder, and Cushings. She also said low starch feed is important for horses with those 4 conditions. She stressed that for overweight horses it's important to reduce the amount of grain and exercise them.

I wasn't aware there was low calorie horse feed, but she says that ponies and Haflingers need this type. I've only had two horses - one I wanted to get as much fat as possible into, and one I don't give any grain to, unless it's to hide medicine.

I liked the way the article ended, "Is low X feed also good for healthy horses?" The nutritionist answered, "Yes, better than too many calories and too much starch.": )

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For years I've been mystified by the marketing of "shedding season vitamins." In Germany it seems horses require something special while shedding. (Healthy horses.) I am intensely curious if this is true, because I'd never heard it mentioned in America. These vitamins are not designed to help a horse shed faster, I believe, they are marketed as necessary for the health of the horse during this time of year.

Lucky for me, there's also an article this month on this topic. The same nutritionist said, "If your horse has adequate nutrition all year, you don't need to buy anything special for him during shedding season." Well that's gonna hurt some businesses, if people believe her.

Another article says, "During shedding season, horses can be lazy and unmotivated." (As opposed to nearly unrideable due to weather-induced insanity?)

Both articles say, "During shedding season, the horse's immune system is weaker." Is this true? I cannot find answers on this on English websites.

"In order to support the immune system, you can feed more apples, bananas, carrots, and beets during this time."

Anyway, it's interesting to me to do Google searches in English and then German and see the differences in the results. I googled "Shedding season vitamins horse" and in English, I get no results under Shopping. The same search in German (Shopping category) gives a large array of products.


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Finally, there is an article about "How much weight can a horse carry?"

First a physiotherapist talks about body types. I found it interesting that she says a long waisted rider with broad shoulders has a higher center of gravity and has more difficulty staying balanced during spooks. Oh, that's me! Curse my huge shoulders! (And other large body parts above my waist.)

She says that it's important for the saddle to fit the buttocks of the rider, and that Western saddles offer more space for "powerful" buttocks. : ) (I think that's Quatsch .)

How much weight then can a horse carry? She says it's not an easy question to answer, but the rule of thumb is 10% of the horse's body weight. (1000 pound horse can carry 100 pounds, including saddle.) Then she says a study in Great Britain showed that 10% is unrealistic, that many riders go over this limit. She goes on to say heavy riders who ride well are kinder to a horse than thin riders who ride poorly.

The sample image shows a lady in white breeches on a horse, and though she's not overweight her white breeches perhaps give this effect. The caption reads, "If the horse and saddle and rider fit together, the horse can carry a few more kilos." Oh that poor lady. She won't wear those breeches again.

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All in all I'm happy with my new magazine, it's well done and always has articles I'm interested in. It also explains concepts in a way I can understand as a non-native speaker. And I always enjoy the stealth-riding-school reviews, which reveal how many crappy, but certified! trainers are out there. *shudder*

13 comments:

Cricket said...

I have added Omega Max by Triple Crown to Ashke's diet for almost a year now, mostly because he was not shedding out last year and his coat was not as shiny as I wanted. I think this was residual issues from his poor nutrition. It has helped to increase his fat in his supplement, which in turn helps with keeping him fueled, and has resulted in a much better mane, tail and coat. (We get compliments all the time on how good his coat looks.)

As far as weight and horse back riding goes, if the germans were right, no man could ride. Ever. Only Jockeys. Horses have been used for thousands of years to carry or drag thousands of pounds. I would pay attention to this line of thought about as much as I would pay attention to my dogs barking.

Piccolopony said...

I would agree with the previous comment. I've only ever heard the 20% or 25% rule although of course lighter is better. I really wonder if a study has ever been done on how detrimental it is that we are breeding such overly large horses. That can't possibly be healthy either.

irish horse said...

The magazine sounds interesting, but shedding vitamins? I could see adding a fat source (like flax) to improve overall nutrition. Lazy and unmotivated in Spring? Can someone tell my horse that as he galloped away from me in the pasture and ran laps after a 20 mile ride the day before?

The long-waisted thing is interesting. I'm built like that too: long waisted and short legs, and used to have so many issues with tipping forward till I got a good saddle.

And for the weight issue: ridiculous. Most horses at Tevis are less than 1000 pounds. And most riders far exceed 100 pounds. So one of the toughest rides in the world obviously has no finishers because those poor horses cant carry them...silly.

Nicole A said...

The Germans are so advanced in some things and so backwards (or just plain weird!) in others.

A lot of young Thoroughbreds racing on the track are less than 1000 lbs, especially mares. Consider that the average jockey weighs 100 lbs. If what the Germans say were true, not even jockeys could ride!

I meant to comment on the Icelandic post and never got around to it. If Icelandics could only carry 140 lbs, how did they carry the Vikings who bred them and rode them all over creation? Pretty sure the average Viking man weighed more than 140 lbs!

I agree that the horse's build has a lot to do with its ability to carry heavier weight. Shorter horses with larger hooves, shorter backs and plenty of bone (think foundation-type Quarter Horses) can carry more weight than lean, lanky tall horses with tiny feet and long backs (think OTTBs). There's a reason why foundation QHs looked the way they did: they were made to carry men all day long across miles and miles of terrain for days on end. Icelandics were bred with the same goal in mind: they are much stockier than, say, a Welsh pony.

So that's my 2 cents on the subject. :) If Germans were right, most of us would never have gotten on a horse and ridden successfully. At my absolute thinnest as a 16 yo with an eating disorder, I weighed 100 lbs and looked like a skeleton. I'm 5'4": average height. Good for the Germans if they can maintain such an unrealistic weight! Maybe that's why their equestrian knowledge is so backwards: because so few of them ride!!

Regarding shedding season, I've never heard such a thing. Cortisol levels in horses do go up in the spring to stimulate their coats to shed. This *can* cause laminitis and even founder in Cushing's horses but it's not as common as the fall founder that you see in these horses: cortisol levels don't rise as much as they do in the fall. That's my only logical explanation for te reasoning behind a weakened immune system in the spring: elevated cortisol levels can, in theory, adversely affect the immune system, but you're going to see this more in the Cushings horse, not the average healthy horse. And in a Cushings horse you wouldn't supplement vitamins in the spring, you would increase their pergolide dose. If the horse has concurrent insulin resistance (a completely different issue) then you would also restrict their pasture access. No special vitamins for that either, other than supplying sources of omega-3 like ground flax and vitamin E (both of which horses get from pasture.)


Mrs Shoes said...

Very, very interesting articles re: supplements, vaccinations, etc etc here: http://www.doctorramey.com/

Rider weight: I echo Karen Burch on this topic.

I have a newer blog; I'd love it if you would stop by sometime!
http://lifeatthe4shoes.blogspot.ca/

lytha said...

Karen, it's hard for me to ignore this when I'm in the middle of it, and prohibited from shopping for many Arabians (I still browse sale ads). You're right that I should try to ignore it.

Piccolo, if you find that study please let me know.

Irish, I'm not making this stuff up! In the endurance rides I've visited here, the horses have it pretty easy when it comes to weight carried. And terrain...

Saiph, glad you agree. The Viking thing, yes, I read that too, that Icelandics are the only horse in that country, and grown men ride them in the mountains on roundups. I should move there: )

Mrs, I enjoy the Dr Ramey site, especially his article on homeopathy - please check it out, along with the YouTube link at the end where a man drinks his own urine. Hi-larious!

Nina said...

Very interesting part about these vitamins for shedding season.

I'm from Germany and spent a lot of time on horse ranches in Canada. I never heard about those vitamins in Canada, just in Germany but I never gave them to my horse and guess what - it survived! :D

I'm not a professional but I believe that if you give the correct feed/minerals/vitamins to your horse all year around you don't need special stuff for shedding season.

All the best from the Rhineland ;)
Nina

lytha said...

Nina, I enjoyed your story about importing horses from Canada to Europe - I used the same company so it surprised me when your photos were similar to mine. (Read about it here: http://horsecrazyamerican.blogspot.de/2008/09/flying-on-747-with-my-horse.html)

Wenn du in Rheinland bist, bist du in meiner Naehe. Das macht mich nervoes, denn die Pferdewelt hier so klein ist, und ich schreibe ueber Leuten ohne ihr Erlaubnis. Ich habe das Gefuehl, es ist nur eine Frage von Zeit, bis ich Aerger von Nachbarn bekomme...

Ich freue mich dein blog zu finden und ich hoffe dass du (mehr) ueber den Unterschied zwischen die Pferdewelt in Canada und Deutschland schreibst.

Oh, und nach importieren hat mein Pferd kein Pferdepass - es war nie noetig, weiss nicht warum.

Nina said...

Hey Lytha, thank you! I read your post - the pictures look really similar, that's crazy :D We probably had the same experience. Glad you enjoyed my blog post series :)

The rhineland is bigger than you think. You are in NRW, I'm in Rhineland Palatinate - still rhineland anyways ;)

I know what you mean with writing about other people... well just be yourself and don't care what they think ;) I try not to mention names. If you talk about their mistakes and you are afraid they find out... they are probably not even aware that you are talking about THEM :D


About the Equidenpass - it's the law to have one. It won't be a problem though, but when you need to trailer your horse and get into a general traffic check you need to show it or you are in trouble ;)

Becky Bean said...

It's interesting to consider that Germans feel about our rider-to-horse ratio the way we feel about the rider-to-horse ratio of those tiny little horses they use at Mexican "ride on the beach" tourist thingies.

Also... take a pic of the "chubby" in her white breeches? Pretty please?

White Horse Pilgrim said...

My copy of the US Cavalry Manual of Horsemanship advises that a horse can carry up to 25% of its bodyweight in rider, saddle and equipment. The cavalry generally was careful with its horses as, being short of funds, it needed hem to have long working lives. It would have helped that cavalry riders were young and fit. My experience running a wilderness trail riding business supports the 25% rule of thumb. What matters is that the tack fits, the riders are balanced and the horses are worked thoughtfully.

Achieve1dream said...

On the weight thing I was told never over 30%. I think it's insanely unrealistic to think 10%... maybe they are trying to make people give up riding horses because it's "so cruel"?? Also I think the vitamin thing is a crock, but it's really interesting to read what Saiph said. I didn't know that about the cortisol.

I'm glad they are jumping on the low starch bandwagon. That's weird about the oats being evil thing though lol. Thanks for sharing all of this with us. It's really interesting!

Achieve1dream said...

Oh and I have to agree with the long waisted/top heavy thing. I definitely do not sit spooks or bucks as well as shorter people! That's been my experience anyway.